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Rank: Newbie
Joined: 11/2/2009
Posts: 3
Location: London
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Thanks for the info. It is great to hear direct from the technology specialists.
So, I understand that the new Dark Fire technology will not fit other guitars, but could it be retrofitted to a Robot Les Paul, or other Les Paul models without getting out the woodworking tools? For example: are the bridge pin spacings of the Piezo bridge the same as the old Les Paul bridge? Is the cavity big enough for the battery and PCB?
Would Tronical be allowed to sell a generic Les Paul Upgrade kit with all the necessary parts, or would it be up to Gibson to decide to bring this to market? I'm sure that a lot of Les Paul owners would be very interested in a retrofit Les Paul Dark Fire upgrade kit. I'll be first in line with a fist full of money (or at least a very abused credit card)!
If Gibson would sell Dark Fire spares parts, then I guess we could just order individual bits, but a kit would be easier
and probably cheaper.
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Rank: Member
Joined: 5/23/2009
Posts: 13
Location: Hamburg
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Timsav,
Re: Dark Fire Upgrade Kits
1) The new Dark Fire technology will fit in virtually any LES Paul style guitar, if the basic design parameters and reference values are at least similar. Crucial points are:
- headstock drill pattern
- electronic cavity dimensions (depth!!)
- toggle switch position
- bridge and tailpiece stud spacings
- Jack Plate routing
2)
It would also be possible to have an Upgrade Kit to Dark Fire´s tuning specs only (no Chameleon Technology!!).
Therefore the cavity dimensions and the toggle switch position would not be a deal breaker, even SG, Explorer and FV models would be possible by using adapted headstock Contacting PCBs, like the different GOR models used to have. Also, Bridge and tail stud spacings are the same and would fit.
Finally I want to point out that all Tronical technology is exclusive to Gibson.
However, its up to Gibson to bring an Upgrade Kit to market, we will see....
Tronical
You play. We tune.
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Rank: Newbie
Joined: 10/25/2009
Posts: 7
Location: earth
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tronical.member wrote:It would also be possible to have an Upgrade Kit to Dark Fire´s tuning specs only (no Chameleon Technology!!).
Therefore the cavity dimensions and the toggle switch position would not be a deal breaker, even SG, Explorer and FV models would be possible b thank you tronical for this bit of encouraging news. I realize it is ultimately up to gibson, but I am more of an SG player then Les Paul, and I like my SG standard Silverburst Robot lots. But then again perhaps a retrofit on my 72 LP goldtop deluxe might be kind of cool too. :-)
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Rank: Newbie
Joined: 11/2/2009
Posts: 3
Location: London
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tronical.member wrote:
Finally I want to point out that all Tronical technology is exclusive to Gibson.
However, its up to Gibson to bring an Upgrade Kit to market, we will see....
Maybe you could talk to the Gibson marketing guys? In the meantime we will just have to wait (or buy a Dark Fire!) Thanks again for the info. It's just incredible what you have got to work. You guys are amazing! Cheers, Tim
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Rank: Member  Joined: 12/27/2008 Posts: 23
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From Tronical:
"It would also be possible to have an Upgrade Kit to Dark Fire´s tuning specs only (no Chameleon Technology!!).
Therefore the cavity dimensions and the toggle switch position would not be a deal breaker, even SG, Explorer and FV models would be possible by using adapted headstock Contacting PCBs, like the different GOR models used to have. Also, Bridge and tail stud spacings are the same and would fit."
Ok now I'm really confused.
Tronical please tell me?
What exactly can my Robot SG be upgraded with????
I thought the body cavity is too shallow in the SG.
-Tom
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Rank: Member
Joined: 5/23/2009
Posts: 13
Location: Hamburg
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Argutus,
its very easy:
1)
SG upgrade to full Dark Fire SPECS (including Chameleon Tone Technology) is nearly impossible, because the Dark Fire is a complete new design for Les Paul models only. For example, the electronic cavity of the SG models is way less deep than the LP cavity. Also, the Toggle switch is located in this cavity, too. The new design of the complete Dark Fire System does not fit for SG.
It may be possible by moving the toggle to the LP toggle position, and by using short threaded pots...
Very likely that there are other points which I am not aware of at the moment!
All of this requires major routing work... I would call that "destructive".
Most of the above is due to Dark Fires Chameleon Tone Technology and the respective electronic hardware.
This could be left out:
2)
It would be possible to have an Upgrade Kit to Dark Fire´s Tuning Specs only (no Chameleon Tone Technology!!).
Therefore the cavity dimensions and the toggle switch position would not be a deal breaker, even SG, Explorer and FV models would be possible to upgrade, for example by using adapted headstock Contacting PCBs, like the different GOR models used to have. Also, Bridge and tail stud spacings are the same and would fit.
Long story short: The electronic hardware for the Chameleon Tone makes the difference due to existing cavity space.
Tronical
You play. We tune.
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Rank: Member Joined: 12/27/2008 Posts: 23
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Thanks for answering so quickly!
Thanks for your patients!
So as I understand it. I can upgrade to the new smaller faster Dark fire robo tuners without the Chameleon Tone Technology, This is possible with an SG.
Am I correct on this?
-Tom
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Rank: Newbie
Joined: 10/25/2009
Posts: 7
Location: earth
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only if Gibson ever offers it in that configuration.
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Rank: Member Joined: 12/27/2008 Posts: 23
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embrionic:
I'm gonna try and find out tomorrow. I'll post what they tell me.
-Tom
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Rank: Member
Joined: 5/23/2009
Posts: 13
Location: Hamburg
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Re:
"only if Gibson ever offers it in that configuration."
Thats right.
Tronical
You play. We tune.
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Rank: Advanced Member  Joined: 10/14/2009 Posts: 59 Location: France
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What I read is that info as possible to be spent with the new systems and mechanical tuning faster. For Tone Chameleon is impossible because the Dark Fire was dug in a particular way and the robot has no room to receive these items. But how ordered and fitted to the new system of mechanical and Where. It is also noteworthy that the third generation of robot annotation informally by the staff of Gibson at the end of 2009. Three staff member confided to me there. To see the innovations it will be and if the upgrade will be possible for the First Robot and Dark Fire §
http://sites.google.com/site/autourdunrelflex/
Alhambra classic 1993/Gibson SG Std 1996/Fender Jaguar'62 1997/Ovation celebrity 157B 1998/Gibson Lp Studio gold 1999/Ibanez Trb-100/Gibson Lp Custom 2004/Warlock platinium 2004/Legend Strato project Happy Three Friend/Epiphone Sheraton 2 2004/Fender Precision Bass reissue '54 Blue Flower/Epiphone Emily the Strange 2006/Delson For Fun/PRS SE Custom 2007/Gibson Lp Custom Blackwidow Lt 25 2009/Gibson Lp Dark Fire 2009
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